NJ Localities Meeting Pension Obligations

The party line:

The state has certainly done their fair share of shirking but what about local governments?

I am researching what counties been paying into the New Jersey Retirement System for their Public Employees (PERS) and Police and Fire Personnel (PFRS) since Union County has been budgeting more than they were billed but the 2021 budgets for 7 of the 21 counties are not out yet so that project is on hold.

But in going over the history of what Union County has been sending to PERS and PFRS since 2005 (which presumably would be in line with other localities) there have been some politically motivated swings but, bottom line, Union County’s ‘fair share’ is now defined as 25 times more than what it was in 2005 for PERS and 8 times more for PFRS.

38 responses to this post.

  1. NO, not Ms Maher again 🤮 With her “Employees have been making THEIR deposit [contributions] …” bullshit again🤬🤬🤬 Stop it, Elizabeth’s voice hurts my ears and her whopper lies gives me brain damage 🐻 I wonder if she realizes that the employees contributions only accounts for about 5%-10% of the overall COST of their multi-million $$$ taxpayer funded pensions and retiree healthcare!

    Reply

  2. Union County’s ‘fair share’ is now defined as 25 times more than what it was in 2005 for PERS and 8 times more for PFRS
    Not taking the employees side, but from an objective point of view, was the Muni and/or Local Government/s fully funding their portion to the system 2005? Second, were any retroactive spikes added after 2005? Both questions need to be answered before assigning blame and liability….

    Reply

  3. Posted by Tough Love on April 20, 2021 at 1:16 pm

    The COLA suspension and the 2% partial* budget cap sure helped dampen earlier year increases.

    THANK YOU Gov. Christie. NOBODY else could have accomplished that.
    ——————–

    The original proposal was for a 2.5% budget cap that INCLUDED Local pension contributions. Too bad we couldn’t get THAT passed. It would have put SOOOOO much downward pressure on Local spending, that Taxpayers would have DEMANDED material pension reform.

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    • Posted by E on April 20, 2021 at 2:07 pm

      Yea he was such a great governor. Dana Redd says so right?
      Then why are you so worried about my pension then?
      Thanks to Christie we had to screw over new hires to get our medical back for nothing after retirement. And we had to create S5 to protect our pensions and try to get cola back.
      Outside of that, my pensions probably will be only $127,000 or so instead of say $137,000 to 140,000.
      All those cop layoffs worked as well then as defunding does now. Always had you pegged as Morris County or somewhere in that area. Didn’t think you were a Bergen resident like me. It was wishful thinking on my part. Lol. Go ride a bike……

      Reply

      • Posted by Tough Love on April 20, 2021 at 2:49 pm

        Quoting ……………..

        “Then why are you so worried about my pension then?”

        Oh the 10+ TIMES more costly TAXPAYER cost (than what Private Sector workers get from their employers) isn’t enough for you ? If COLA’s hadn’t been suspended, your pension’s cost would be about 1/3 HIGHER.

        How do you spell “moocher” ?
        ——————

        Quoting ………………..

        “Thanks to Christie we had to screw over new hires to get our medical back for nothing after retirement. ”

        Oh BS, you screwed over new hires because the older/long-service Officers are GREEDY and don’t want to “share the pain”.

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        • Posted by E on April 20, 2021 at 2:57 pm

          Shut the fuck up. You have stated on here that you would have taken the same deal if offered to you. Only a fool wouldn’t. Don’t act like your a defender of the younger officer. You’d fuck them over pay wise or wokeness wise long before I would. Take it don’t a notch before your nastiness causes a nasty reaction back. You know….a reaction like “fuck you, pay me”.

          Reply

          • Posted by Tough Love on April 20, 2021 at 4:37 pm

            I doubt that I would have suggested a different deal …………. and not doing so would have also made ME greedy.

            Wouldn’t make either of us right.

            —————–
            Quoting …………. “Don’t act like your a defender of the younger officer. You’d fuck them over pay wise”

            No, NOT “pay wise”, but certainly wrt pensions & benefits BECUASE they are ludicrously excessive.

            The Total Compensation of ALL Public Sector workers should mirror the Total Compensation of Private Sector workers in comparable jobs, or there are no comparable jobs (such as Police), then in jobs that require reasonably comparable experience, education, skills and knowledge.

            And on THAT (very reasonable basis) NJ Police are VASTLY over-compensated.

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      • Posted by Tough Love on April 20, 2021 at 6:23 pm

        Quoting E ………….

        “Thanks to Christie we had to screw over new hires to get our medical back for nothing after retirement. And we had to create S5 to protect our pensions and try to get cola back.”

        The greed in those 2 sentences is just so overwhelming.

        (1) “get our medical back for nothing after retirement”
        WHY is that fair to Taxpayers who …….. for you ALONE …. will cost them about $500,000 before you reach Medicare age when employer-sponsored retiree healthcare is VERY VERY rare in the Private Sector.

        (2) “create S5 to……….. try to get cola back.”
        WHY is that fair to Taxpayers who …….. for you ALONE if reinstated …. will cost them about an ADDITIONAL $500,000 in pension benefits when in the now-rare Private Sector DB pension, CLOA increases were NEVER included?

        What make Public Sector workers so “special” that they deserve a better deal ….. an extraordinarily better deal for YOU ….. on the Taxpayers’ Dime ?

        Reply

    • Posted by geo8rge on April 21, 2021 at 12:21 pm

      “THANK YOU Gov. Christie. NOBODY else could have accomplished that.”
      Wasn’t Christie one of those Maga hat wearing Trump supporters?

      Reply

  4. Posted by Tough Love on April 20, 2021 at 5:06 pm

    BREAKING NEWS ………….

    Derek Chauvin GUILTY of 2-nd degree murder.

    EXACTLY what was deserved !

    Reply

    • Posted by Anonymous on April 20, 2021 at 6:31 pm

      Clearly the jury did not give due diligence. But whatever TL if that makes you happy. Fucking drug addict, hopped on a lethal dose of drugs and not even worth $20 on the day of his overdose makes you happy. You are the village idiot of NJ

      Reply

    • Posted by Anonymous on April 20, 2021 at 6:37 pm

      $27 Million dollars of taxpayer money to the family of a person who had to counterfeit $20. Who paid? Taxpayers. Oh FFS you are so stupid. Not to mention he likely died of a drug overdose … a drug overdoes probably caused by Mexican cartels bringing that shit over the boarder. Keep it coming. Biden loves it.

      Reply

      • Posted by Tough Love on April 20, 2021 at 7:37 pm

        I don’t agree with the $27 Million either, but CLEARLY Chauvin MURDERED Mr. Floyd and justice prevailed.

        And you’re quite the crackpot (not that that surprises me from your prior comments). Apparently you have no problem with 3 to 4 minutes STILL with his knee into Floyd’s neck AFTER he stopped moving (and was likely dead).

        Reply

    • Posted by Marine1 on April 20, 2021 at 7:00 pm

      TL- Is it wrong that I feel pretty good about Floyd never roaming the earth again ? I mean we are talking about a guy who put a loaded gun to a pregnant ladies stomach. He only received 4 years for that,hardly enough. As for Chauvin he deserves to go to prison for his stupidity.

      Reply

      • Posted by E on April 20, 2021 at 7:12 pm

        Sacrificial lamb. A fair sentence will be in the 15-20 range. Justin volpe got 30 if you remember.

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        • Posted by Tough Love on April 20, 2021 at 8:22 pm

          Given that in Minn. he will serve only 2/3 of his sentence, I hope he gets 30 yrs so that he has to serve 20 years.

          And hardly a sacrificial lamb ……….. more accurately a murderer.

          Reply

          • Posted by NJ2AZ on April 20, 2021 at 8:25 pm

            i’m still confused how he eats three murder wraps for one murder. i always just assumed they charged murder 2/3 and manslaughter to give the jury options to convict on one, not all three.

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          • Posted by E on April 20, 2021 at 9:41 pm

            Yes…..if you unintentionally kill one person, you would think that it is either murder 2, murder 3 or manslaughter.
            Not all of the above. But as I said 15-20 and serving say 12-15 would be fair.
            The Potter woman should get maybe 2-3 tops. The Chicago shooting ? Clean shoot.

            Reply

          • i’m still confused how he eats three murder wraps for one murder. i always just assumed they charged murder 2/3 and manslaughter to give the jury options to convict on one, not all three.
            That was indeed strange. Usually you file cases like this as an “Open Murder” charge, and you put all the murder degrees on the table, at least the ones that have probable cause, and then you let the JURY PICK THE ONE THAT APPLIES, as in one., not all three. This case to me is not even a close call on 2nd degree murder, or even voluntary manslaughter. This case was 4th degree murder, or involuntary manslaughter, all the way. I am shocked the jury came back with 2nd degree.

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          • Posted by Tough Love on April 20, 2021 at 10:13 pm

            E,

            If that Chicago shooting is the young kid, granted he did have a gun that he dropped behind the fence, but the video clearly shows the kid with his hands up with NO GUN before being shot.

            Certainly nothing like the Floyd case, but I’d bet that the Officer will be charger and convicted of manslaughter. That video will be damning evidence.

            Reply

          • TL. Did you watch the stills of that video? Take the totality of the entire situation. Seven or eight shots fired at a moving vehicle. 2:30am. Officer responds and the kid runs away. Officer chases down dark alley. Kid reaches the point where the fence has the part missing.
            Then kid blades himself in such a manner that the right hand has a gun visible and is further away from the officer than his left hand and body. The right hand at this point is all that the officer is focused on. Elbows and shoulders don’t kill you. Hands and fingers do in this instance. Less than one split second(according to the body cam) later is the still you are talking about with the hands up. In that one second, the suspect moves the right hand with the gun in it behind his body out of the view of the officer, tosses the gun behind the fence out of view of the officer, then while turning to the left, brings the right hand back into view of the officer, who at which point had already made the decision to fire. Presumably (although I don’t know for sure) because he felt that the suspect would in fact not drop the gun but instead would raise his right hand with the gun in it and fire. In which case the officer would be likely to lose his life. Remember, the actual reason the officer was there was because the suspect had likely fired the weapon that the officer saw in his right hand.
            Perception/reaction time in a average Person is roughly 1.6 seconds. Meaning that if he truly thought the suspect would fire upon him while raising that hand, it would take 1.6 seconds to perceive the open hand and react by not firing his weapon.
            100% clean shoot. Literal split second decision. He did not make the wrong decision.

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          • Also throw in the fact that the officer’s heart rate and adrenaline were elevated from the foot chase, a manslaughter charge, much less a conviction, will not be likely. But who knows? I could be wrong. We are all woke and anti cop now right?

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          • Posted by Tough Love on April 20, 2021 at 11:33 pm

            Quoting E………….

            “…..then while turning to the left, brings the right hand back into view of the officer, who at which point had already made the decision to fire. ”

            Who knows, but (especially at this time) a DA and a jury may not be “OK” with that.

            Certainly NOT a Chauvin scenario. Too bad there is so much garbage out there that put police in difficult situations like this.

            Reply

    • Posted by geo8rge on April 21, 2021 at 12:26 pm

      I agree. When Floyd escaped from the police vehicle and collapsed on the road way the police should have handled it ‘old school’. Call an ambulance and then smoke some cigarettes until the ambulance arrives and they are needed to collect Floyd’s corpse.

      Reply

      • Posted by E on April 22, 2021 at 1:37 pm

        George, you are absolutely right. When I first started there were still a few “greaser from the 50’s types” that said that is what would’ve happened on most medicals years back. Even cardiac arrests. No to minimal first aid was right back then and often times they would just light up a cigarette and bullshit with the other officers or victim if they were conscious and alert. It wasn’t until about the late sixties that CPR was taught and cops learned even basic first aid.

        Reply

  5. Posted by MJ on April 20, 2021 at 7:14 pm

    I’m not sure that we were privy to all testimony or if I missed some of it but no matter what the circumstances, Chavin’s knee should not have been on his neck for as long as it was. Chauvin was stupid to take him out of the police cruiser. How could the jury possibly be totally unbiased with the circus surrounding this case? How could they not feel intimidated with Maxine Waters and the other nut job encouraging confrontation? Biden saying he is praying for the right verdict. Was there due diligence, we will never know. If I was on the jury, knowing what I know, I don’t think I could convict of all the charges beyond a reasonable doubt. Definitely guilty of excessive force, definitely guilty in that his actions contributed to that man’s death. 27 million for the family, come on man.

    TL, do you think he will still get his pension 🙂 🙂

    Reply

    • Posted by Tough Love on April 20, 2021 at 8:25 pm

      Yup. He’ll get the 1/2 his wife doesn’t get. He’s going to be a big man at the Prison commissary.

      Reply

      • Posted by E on April 20, 2021 at 9:44 pm

        MJ is right tho. Elected officials should just say “let the case play itself out”. Waters sucks. She could’ve blown this thing up. I’m sure Chauvin will appeal. Personally, I wish he had made a deal months ago. His lawyer did a poor job defending him. Again, I think 12-15 of ACTUAL time is fair.

        Reply

    • Posted by A on April 20, 2021 at 9:00 pm

      I believe he has to wait till he is fifty.

      As I understand, with CalPERS, I could have opted, instead of monthly pension, to withdraw my contributions, plus accumulated interest, for whatever dumb reason.

      If I were unmarried.

      Since California is a community property state, half my pension belongs to her, and I could –not– opt out without her signature.

      Ask my wife’s brother, who is retired Coast Guard. (20 years, half pay, full medical. It is expensive.) Half his pension goes to his ex. And full medical for her, too.

      Reply

  6. Posted by A on April 20, 2021 at 7:42 pm

    “Retirement plan officials said that employees terminated voluntarily or for cause are eligible for future benefits unless they choose to forfeit their future benefit and receive a refund of all their contributions made during their employment.”

    Or his (ex)wife? Depending on Minnesota community property law.

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  7. […] Posted on April 20, 2021April 20, 2021 by Mary Pat Campbell NJ Localities Meeting Pension Obligations […]

    Reply

  8. Posted by MJ on April 21, 2021 at 6:37 am

    I, too was wondering how Chauvin could be convicted of 3 different categories of murder charges. The discussion here helped to clear it up a bit. We shall see if he can appeal. I thought that his wife divorced him right after the incident?
    What a horrible situation all around.

    Again, his police pension is the least of the issue that went on here.

    Reply

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