NJ COLA Briefs

Briefs in the New Jersey Cost-of-Living-Adjustment (COLA) case were submitted today and, though I will not have a chance to go over them until after October 15, some of you might want to weigh in:

Brief on behalf of State of New Jersey
Brief on behalf of pro se appelant – Charles Ouslander
Amicus brief from the State Troopers Association

21 responses to this post.

  1. Posted by Tough Love on October 15, 2015 at 2:15 am

    On page 11 of 85 of the State’s Brief, it says:

    “PRELIMINARY STATEMENT

    No one disputes that the retirees in these consolidated cases have a non-forfeitable
    right to their base pensions. The State reiterates that it is not walking away from this
    obligation and will continue to pay these benefits when due. ”

    Oh really ?

    When the State Plans have zero assets in about 5 years, to continue “paying” full benefits will require an ADDITIONAL $8+ Billion in tax increases. There is not a snowballs chance hell that that will happen.

    I believe that the “State” knows that, but for THIS (the COLA) challenge they are putting that very major problem aside …… for THIS fight..

    Reply

    • Posted by Anonymous on October 15, 2015 at 5:10 am

      taxes will go up regardless of what happens.

      Reply

      • Posted by dentss dunnigan on October 15, 2015 at 11:32 am

        The funny part is what taxes ? they can’t even raise the gas tax ,and everyone is on board for a hike ,but don’t want to do so before the election .

        Reply

    • Posted by Anonymous on October 15, 2015 at 8:40 am

      Are you alleging the State (ie the Governor’s administration at his direction) would knowingly lie in a legal proceeding? Kinda like c.78, we know he’s good at this stuff just ask the alleged Ft. Dix terrorists. Maybe he should really set a precedent and forgo his taxpayer funded Federal pension – just to be fair.

      Reply

    • Posted by Anonymous on October 15, 2015 at 10:14 am

      The payments will come from the General Account of the NJ Treasury.

      Reply

      • Posted by Tough Love on October 15, 2015 at 1:25 pm

        And were does that money come from genius ?

        Reply

      • Good luck with that. The first legislative drone that sponsors general tax hikes to pay for these ridiculous pensions that NO ONE (other than Fortune 500 CEO’s) in the private sector gets will be recalled faster than that idiot Gray Davis and that was pretty quick.

        Reply

    • Posted by dentss dunnigan on October 15, 2015 at 11:30 am

      I wonder how many Illinois PENSIONERS kept up with the news out of Greece the last few years and see the parallels?…They too were told they would get all of their owed money ….

      Reply

      • Posted by Anonymous on October 15, 2015 at 12:14 pm

        Hmm pay close attention ALL Federal, State, and Local members, active and retired, b/c according to DD we’re the next Greece!

        Reply

    • Posted by ModernDiogenes on December 2, 2015 at 4:06 am

      Actually that is incorrect. Well, at least in regard to the PFRS. When Christie Whitman wanted to use our pension fund as an asset to secure her Homestead Rebate bonding issue we made sure that it was only upon the passing of a state statute that stated that even if the State of New Jersey was to go bankrupt, the members of the PFRS would be the first to get paid, in full, before any other parties owed.
      Also, many of the PBA locals, my own for instance, have the language of the statute written directly into our contracts. COLA is specifically, therefore, a clause under monetary remuneration in the wording covering the deferred payment clause which covers pension and COLA, right there with vacation pay, uniform allowance, stipends for special assignments, etc. Again, directly written into the contract using the same language as the state statute.
      It is, trust me, contractual.

      Reply

  2. Posted by Anonymous on October 15, 2015 at 5:14 am

    state says cola threaten stability of pension fund, what about not paying into the pension fund for 40 years, the court already said that was okay and we all know that threatened the stability.

    Reply

    • Posted by Tough Love on October 15, 2015 at 1:28 pm

      Back up to the ROOT CAUSE ….. Public Sector pensions that are TYPICALLY 3-4 times (4-6 times for safety workers) greater in “value at retirement” than those of comparable Private Sector workers whey they retire at the SAME age, with the SAME pay, and the SAME years of service.

      Reply

      • Posted by ModernDiogenes on December 2, 2015 at 4:13 am

        My reply to that is 1) your figures are inaccurate but, 2) I cordially invite you to strap on a sidearm and patrol the streets of Newark, Paramus, Paterson, Atlantic City, Camden, Passaic, etc, etc, etc.

        It constantly confounds me the number of people willing to comment on the remuneration, fairly negotiated in good faith, for a job that benefits them but that they would never remotely consider doing for themselves.

        My feeling on this is thus: Until you are willing to walk a beat/ride a squad car beside me, do what I do, take the risks I take, to protect and serve you, just say thank you. Then treat the comments you might care to make about what I make doing it the way you would want me to treat any comments I might have about what you make for what you do, and be done with it.

        Reply

  3. Posted by Anonymous on October 15, 2015 at 1:40 pm

    Hey TL does the state even have the money to pay back all the contributions made into pension system to all those employees who have not retired yet. If they would do that it would be honest and guess what your taxes would have to go up substantially just to give the money they put in without even paying anything towards their retirement or even giving them interest on their money. you are sunk no matter how you look at it your taxes are going up

    Reply

    • Posted by Tough Love on October 15, 2015 at 4:40 pm

      Yes they do because it’s not as much a Public Sector Unions/workers would like us to believe.

      Your promised pensions are so absurdly generous, that ALL of the employee contributions if accumulated WITH expected investment income to the date of retirement, is RARELY sufficient to buy more than 10-20% of your promised pensions.

      Reply

      • Posted by Tough Love on October 15, 2015 at 4:47 pm

        And the dollar amount of employee contributions is TYPICALLY 5% to 10% of the dollar amount of your expected pension payments (i.e., for your life expectancy).

        Reply

  4. Posted by Anonymous on October 15, 2015 at 5:13 pm

    Tell it to the 1%’s like the KOCH BROS who have gotten away with not paying, what the majority’s feels, is their fair share. While at the same time their net wealth in real dollars has grown exponteially compared to the rest of us – well excluding you and a few others on this blog!

    Reply

    • Posted by Tough Love on October 15, 2015 at 6:47 pm

      Irrelevant …… a red-herring to try to justify Middle Class PUBLIC Sector pensions that are ROUTINELY 3 to 6 times greater in value at retirement than those of comparable Middle Class PRIVATE Sector workers.

      Reply

      • Posted by Anonymous on October 15, 2015 at 9:11 pm

        Your sumarily dismissing this well know fact is the elephant in the room – happy fishing, never like herring. Once again you portray yourself the Robin Hood of the middle class when in reality you’re 1% false prophet!

        Reply

        • Posted by Tough Love on October 15, 2015 at 9:34 pm

          Nope, not in the 1% by any measure (wealth or income)…..

          Just well-versed on pension design and funding and smart enough to recognize when I’m being suckered …..by the insatiably greedy Public Sector Unions/workers and the Elected Officials whose favorable votes on Public Sector pay, pensions, and benefits are BOUGHT with Public Sector Union camapign caontrbutions and election support.

          Reply

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