New Jersey Pension Burned


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With this type of bad publicity you have to feel sorry for anyone who invested in The Honest Company.

As it happens Jessica Alba came up last year:

At the September, 2014 meeting of the New Jersey State Investment Council (as covered by NJTV) the focus was on one particular venture capital investment and whether it was made for political reasons:
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But in looking through available information on General Catalyst Partners other questions pop up:

Based on their website General Catalyst Partners (GCP) gives money to a bunch of entrepreneurs who then presumably repay them at usurious rates.

One of the entrepreneurs that GCP (and by extension New Jersey) invested in was Jessica Alba and ‘The Honest Company’ which was started in 2011 but is supposed to be worth nearly $1 billion now with 300 employees and “reportedly raked in $50 million in revenue in 2013″ according to a Yahoo story that admits “right now Honest is getting about 80% of its revenues from its online store where its easier to control the customer experience.”  Is something, based on an idea that must surely have been tried before, that was worth $0 in 2011 really worth $1 billion now?

‘Alternative Investments’ should rightly be called unregulated investments since the theory is that if you are rich enough to afford them then you are financially astute enough not to get burned.  That may be true with people who are investing their own money but what about politicians who have other agendas – like in New Jersey where the emphasis is on investments that:

  1. can have ridiculously high valuations so as to reduce contributions; and
  2. offer the opportunity to help out your friends.

One of Chris Christie’s high school friends (that he has not disavowed yet) Robert Grady oversaw the shift to alternative investments that accomplished those dual purposes but he stepped down last November and a democratic insider is now in charge – just in time to take the fall.

 

66 responses to this post.

  1. Posted by Anonymous on August 4, 2015 at 1:22 pm

    christie taking NJ to new heights of corruption

    Reply

  2. Posted by Anonymous on August 4, 2015 at 1:42 pm

    Tell em like it is TL, this is a misdirection as the root cause is overly generous unsustainable benefits – NOT.

    Only partially true, that’s right it’s Florida again. It’s clear but unknown the compounding effect the lack of reforms (prior to 2011) has had on the unfunded liability. But one things for sure the inconsistent inadequate employer contributions are the root cause to the mess NJ’s in.

    Reply

    • Posted by Tough Love on August 4, 2015 at 4:07 pm

      Repeating the untrue doesn’t make it true.

      The ROOT CAUSE of NJ’s pension mess is traceable to the Grossly excessive pensions and benefits … 3x-4x greater in value at retirement than those of Private Sector workers retiring at he SAME age, with the SAME pay, and the SAME years of service.

      That’s not justifiable … and cannot be explained away.

      Reply

      • Posted by S Moderation Douglas on August 4, 2015 at 6:05 pm

        Pants on fire!

        Still missing one “SAME”

        GIGO

        Reply

      • Posted by BH on August 5, 2015 at 9:21 am

        The ROOT cause of NJs pension mess can be traced to decades of underfunding brought on by taxpayer greed and corporate pandering to the officials in state government. CEOs making millions in bonuses is counter to what the middle class public worker earns!! The same age, same education, same job falicy spewed by TL can be spun the other way as well!!!!
        Time for change!!!!!

        Reply

        • Posted by bpaterson on August 5, 2015 at 10:21 am

          change is right BH-its time to bring the focus back on the regular middle class people…not the govt, not the CEOs, not the public sector workers, but the regular people who’s pockets are paying for all this waste, abuse, largesse and extravagance.

          The system is fully corrupted. No one is looking out for us middle class.

          Reply

          • Posted by BH on August 5, 2015 at 11:17 am

            Let’s not forget though, that regardless of what the haters say, public workers are predominately middle class. And taxpayers as well. That often gets overlooked when people like TL spew venom!!!

          • Posted by Tough Love on August 5, 2015 at 4:20 pm

            Yes, Public Sector workers are taxpayers too. But who but “PUBLIC” Sector workers* advocate FOR (and often rally FOR) tax “increases”?

            Why ? Because THEY KNOW that (being only 15% of ALLworkers) and with almost all of the newly raised revenue from a tax increase will go just to fund their overstuffed pensions & benefits, that THEY will get back over $5 for each $1 in incremental taxes that THEY pay. Hell of a deal !

            Just one more way that PRIVATE Sector Taxpayers are ripped-off by the insatiably greedy PUBLIC Sector workers.

            * and Welfare recipients who like a growing plate of free services w/o paying for them.

          • Posted by dentss dunigan on August 5, 2015 at 4:21 pm

            I would hardly call someone middle class with a seven figure retirement nest egg .anyone retiring with a 35K or more requires one million dollar portfolio to sustain that yearly income .

          • Posted by Tough Love on August 5, 2015 at 5:43 pm

            dentiss dunigan,

            BH conveniently likes to ignore the ENORMOUS “value at retirement”* of the annual Pubic Sector pension annuities, for safety workers RARELY less in NJ than $50K annually, and sometimes over $100K. If each $35K of annual income requires $1 million in principal, then the “VALUE AT RETIREMENT” of those pensions ranges form $1.43 Million to $2.86 Million.

            Private Sector workers making similar wages don’t have a snow-ball’s chance in hell of accumulating such funds in a 401K Plan over a career of the same length….. and unlike Public Sector workers (who RARELY contribute more than 10-20% of their pensions) PRIVATE Sector workers contribute theMAJOR portion of their 401Ks.

            Just one more example of the PUBLIC Sector rip-off of the Taxpayers.

          • Posted by BH on August 5, 2015 at 7:54 pm

            Sure they could TL….. But they have no choices in where their money is robbed…. Errrr I mean invested!!!

  3. Posted by Eric on August 4, 2015 at 3:14 pm

    John:
    Even companies acquiring other companies get “burned” when the acquirer failed to do its homework in evaluating the target. The following is from the book, The Intelligent Investor page 439 referring to Lucent Technologies in acquiring Chromantis Networks for $4.8 billion:
    “Lucent had just bought an optical equipment supplier, Chromantis Networks for $4.8 billion-of which $4.2 billion was “goodwill” (or cost above book value). Chromantis had 150 employees, no customers, and zero revenue so the term “goodwill” seemed inadequate; perhaps “hope chest” is more accurate. If Chromantis’s embryonic products did not work out, Lucent would have to reverse the goodwill and charge it off against future earnings.”
    Guess what happened?
    Eric

    Reply

    • Posted by bpaterson on August 5, 2015 at 10:23 am

      Eric, didn’t Microsoft just do that with nokias phone business it bought. $10 billion up in smoke…of course that’s chump change to Microsoft.

      Reply

  4. Posted by Javagold on August 4, 2015 at 6:08 pm

    Buyer Beware. Public Takers don’t care. Collapse is almost here. Pass me the popcorn and beer.

    Reply

  5. Posted by dentss dunnigan on August 4, 2015 at 6:48 pm

    The way the pension is set up it is responsibility of the taxpayers to make up any investment loses …..don’t we all wish we lived in this Disneyland !d

    Reply

    • Posted by Tough Love on August 4, 2015 at 7:01 pm

      What’s been unfairly promised this 15% of all workers (“PUBLIC” Sector workers) can’t be promised everyone …. there doesn’t exist sufficient money to do so.

      THEY take, and we (the Taxpayers) get suckered to pay for it.

      Reply

    • Posted by BH on August 5, 2015 at 9:00 am

      Wrong!!
      The way the pension is set up, includes –beyond any other fact, the required payment made by the state. Robbing this payment from the pension for decades, thus robing from the workers and giving that money to tax payers as relief and corporations as subsidies and to the welfare takers…… Is the sole reason the system is underfunded and in trouble.
      “Telling it like it is”

      Reply

      • Posted by bpaterson on August 5, 2015 at 10:27 am

        BH-the billions and billions in tax money basically was diverted to the abbot districts. Possibly you should take up your cause with those 29 towns. Start with Hoboken or Neptune as a suggestion.

        Reply

        • Posted by BH on August 5, 2015 at 11:18 am

          Unfortunately, those districts enjoy a constitutional right to such funds!! But so will the public sector workers soon.

          Reply

      • Posted by Tough Love on August 5, 2015 at 10:44 am

        Sorry BH, but BS doesn’t fly …..

        The ARC is A FUNCTION OF and PROPORTIONAL TO the Plan’s generosity. A very rich (i.e., grossly excessive Plan …. as are ALL Public Sector Plans, always MULTIPLES ….. 3x to 4x …greater than those granted comparable Private Sector workers) will have a HUGE ARC.

        There is ZERO justification for taxpayer to pay the excessive ARCs associated with excessive pensions. At least at the State level (so far) NJ’s Taxpayers haven’t done so. BRAVO for them, but we need to KEEP IT that way and fund (for BOTH State AND LOCAL Plans) no more than a pension EQUAL to what THEY (the Taxpayers) typically get …. typically 1/4 to 1/3 the value of NJ’s Public Sector Plans.

        Do you think very generous formulas, COLA increases (thankfully now suspended), young full/unreduced retirement ages 60, 55, even 50, extremely under-priced early retirement factors, Platinum+ healthcare, and cash payouts for unused sick days comes cheap ?

        Well earth to BH, they don’t, and Public Sector workers are not “special” and deserving of a better deal on the taxpayers’ dime.

        Reply

        • Posted by BH on August 5, 2015 at 11:23 am

          Do you think million dollar ceo bonuses come cheap?? Are they special?
          Does the public worker deserve this abuse? Nope!!
          Is it fair to pay someone $800 a month per baby they have?? Nope!!
          Is it fair to allow multi billion dollar companies to thrive in this state while paying nothing in taxes??? Nope!!!
          Is it fair to allow the private sector workers to capitalize on the benefits the unions created while at the same time chastising them?? Nope
          Is it fair to have a governor who spins this mess in his favor while spending 80% of his time away from nj. Nope!!!

          Reply

          • Posted by Tough Love on August 5, 2015 at 11:37 am

            Quoting …”Do you think million dollar ceo bonuses come cheap?? Are they special?”

            It’s “Shareholder” money who can invest elsewhere, or money from “customers” who can choose to shop elsewhere is they feel prices are to high (due to such excess).

            The taxpayers of our States and Cities have no such “choices” …….. when the cost of services is unreasonably high because of grossly excessive pensions & benefits ……… being a captive audience to this extreme greed.

          • Posted by Tough Love on August 5, 2015 at 11:38 am

            Quoting … “Is it fair to allow the private sector workers to capitalize on the benefits the unions created while at the same time chastising them?”

            LOL …. what “benefits” have Public Sector Union created ???

          • Posted by BH on August 5, 2015 at 1:18 pm

            Well, let’s just name a few……
            Thank you unions…. Because of you we all enjoy-

            Weekends without work
            All breaks at work, including your lunch breaks
            Paid vacation
            Family & Medical Leave Act (FMLA)
            Sick leave
            Social Security
            Minimum wage
            Civil Rights Act/Title VII – prohibits employer discrimination
            8-hour work day
            Overtime pay
            Child labor laws
            Occupational Safety & Health Act (OSHA)
            40-hour work week
            Workers’ compensation (workers’ comp)
            Unemployment insurance
            Pensions
            Workplace safety standards and regulations
            Employer health care insurance
            Collective bargaining rights for employees
            Wrongful termination laws
            Age Discrimination in Employment Act of 1967 (ADEA)
            Whistleblower protection laws
            Employee Polygraph Protection Act (EPPA) – prohibits employers from using a lie detector test on an employee
            Veteran’s Employment and Training Services (VETS)
            Compensation increases and evaluations (i.e. raises)
            Sexual harassment laws
            Americans With Disabilities Act (ADA)
            Holiday pay
            Employer dental, life, and vision insurance
            Privacy rights
            Pregnancy and parental leave
            Military leave
            The right to strike
            Public education for children
            Equal Pay Acts of 1963 & 2011 – requires employers pay men and women equally for the same amount of work
            Laws ending sweatshops in the United States

          • Posted by Tough Love on August 5, 2015 at 4:14 pm

            BH,

            I’m talking about “PUBLIC” (not “PRIVATE”) Sector Unions. I read through your list twice, and not one item resulted form “PUBLIC” Sector Unions.

            “PUBLIC” Sector unions are nothing but a CANCER inflicted upon Civilized society.

  6. Posted by S Moderation Douglas Is Wrong Again on August 4, 2015 at 8:04 pm

    I am disliking Christie more and more every day that passes…and I am a pension reformer, and in CA. He seemed like a straight shooter 3 years ago when he SOUNDED like he was going to try to fix the problem, instead he is NOW just kicking the can down the road, and the public employees, who I detest, are going to get burned MUCH more badly than they should. I cannot believe I am actually saying this, but the public employees should be marching on the governors mansion with pitch forks….

    Reply

    • Posted by Tough Love on August 4, 2015 at 9:34 pm

      You’re a pension “reformer” ???????

      Yea right …… as a CA Public Sector retiree, every comment you make FIGHTS reform (which rightfully means REDUCTIONS).

      Perhaps YOUR definition of CA “reform” is to make current and future workers pay more so that YOU can keep the grossly excessive pension you were generated by the politicians BOUGHT with your Union’s campaign contributions and election support.

      Reply

      • Posted by S Moderation Douglas on August 4, 2015 at 10:38 pm

        Read the whole name, brother. He is not I. And he is pulling your leg.

        Reply

        • Posted by Tough Love on August 4, 2015 at 11:59 pm

          Whoops …. mea culpa.

          Of couscous he is …. and I’m just returning it.

          Reply

        • Posted by S Moderation Douglas Is Wrong Again on August 5, 2015 at 2:13 am

          I am NOT pulling anyone’s leg Wingnut Douglas. Christie is an idiot, and I am serious when I say he is jerking the public employees chain all day long. Douglas Wingnut Moderation knows I hate the public unions, but Christie is not even TRYING to fix the problem…..

          Reply

          • Posted by bpaterson on August 5, 2015 at 10:35 am

            SMD-youre right CC knew it was a lost cause when he came into office and was appraised of the underfunding situations. The only governor that actually tried to do something of substance was Corzine and the selling of the turnpike. And that is sort of a 20-20. As I have noted in the past, to at least be somewhat fair, we should return to that idea as the last chance for some recourse. Sell the turnpike, put it toward the pension underfunding, and then rebalance all the plans based on that extra money. The rebalance would be downward of course since the debt is huge, but its the only thing us residents can do to try to correct the absurd situation that the NJ citizens didn’t cause but the political system/ public sector dynamic created.

          • Posted by Tough Love on August 5, 2015 at 10:49 am

            Quoting …. “The only governor that actually tried to do something of substance was Corzine and the selling of the turnpike. ”

            What BS. The Turnpike is a STATE asset, and rightfully belongs to ALL of NJ taxpayers, NOT just the 15% who work in the Public Sector.

            It is really no different than cash, and the funding of these grossly excessive, unnecessary, unjust, unfair, and unaffordable pension promises (BOUGHT from our elected officials with campaign contributions and election support) via the sale of the State’s assets is no more justified than spending cash …. EVEN IF WE HAD IT.

    • Posted by fouls123 on August 5, 2015 at 1:49 am

      So you detest public employees. That statement is the equivalent of I detest black people or I detest hispanic people or I detest all Italians. It is clearly based on ignorance and prejudice. You can disagree with what you may feel is overly generous benefits and I may argue against your point, but to say I detest Public employees is ridiculous. You are going to find wherever you go or work, very hard working and conscientious people, and those who are not and in about the same percentage whether public or private work. I have worked in both and have found no difference in the people. People are people wherever you go. Not even TL has made such a statement and we probably disagree on about everything else, but I think most intelligent and objective people would agree that working a job in public service in no way automatically makes someone worthy of being detested.

      Reply

      • Posted by Tough Love on August 5, 2015 at 3:11 am

        Your correct. For me, it’s the Public Sector Union/worker greed, their to-hell-with-the-taxpayers attitude, and the share of this UNJUST mess I may be called upon to pay for via increased taxes, that fuels my advocacy for very material pension/benefit reform.

        Reply

      • Posted by BH on August 5, 2015 at 9:11 am

        Fouls123, trying to get TL to understand anything about anything is not worth your finger weakness from the typing.
        She is not thinking normally. Her message is driven by hatred, jealousy and contempt. She spews her hatred venom towards these people because she thinks she gets it. Like she’s speaking for the masses!!! Obviously we are outnumbered on this blog…. But it’s an anti pension anti public worker blog.
        No proof, no facts, no justice, that’s Unbiased, will be found here.

        Reply

        • Posted by Tough Love on August 5, 2015 at 10:52 am

          Wow, delusional in the extreme ………

          Reply

        • Posted by bpaterson on August 5, 2015 at 10:55 am

          BH-love that word jealousy that is tossed around when justifying any largesse whether deserved or undeserved. Many use who it have gamed a system to their favor to create a wealth toward them and when found out use the words “your just jealous”. It could certainly apply if the wealth for yourself was created elsewhere, however the people that are complaining about your system you created and gamed are the ones who have the “obligations”. Keep in mind those controlling the other side of the table from you and negotiating for this system are also in the pension system themselves. So its certainly not jealousy, its pure and simple a conflict of interest and illegal.

          as for your other descriptions of TL-hatred I cannot explain since its TLs call and contempt just doesn’t make sense. It would be more appropriate if used as a description of you and your actions towards the taxpayers.

          BTW-you say you are outnumbered on this blog but it appears you are the numerous ones, there’s just 2 maybe 3 with TL’s heavy sentiments, and then also some that are questioning the common sense of the whole system and how we got into this mess. This is the context of the unbiased Mr Bury’s blog.

          Reply

          • Posted by Tough Love on August 5, 2015 at 11:20 am

            What YOU don’t like is that I fully understand finance and the math underlying pensions, and the magnitude of the current financial “mugging” being perpetrated upon NJ’s Private Sector workers (assuming they will indeed have to pay for these grossly excessive promises) …. and I recognize BS when I read it, which includes almost EVERYTHING you say.

          • Posted by BH on August 5, 2015 at 11:33 am

            No, I do not think you’re all that smart TL. You’re copy and paste crap is endless.
            You are driven by hate and jealousy. You are not the people’s speaker as you think. bpaterson simply can’t pick a side…..
            But what you all fail to realize, no matter what you feel or think.
            It is the state of nj who caused this mess. Simple as that.
            You fail to recognize or comment on what would happen if decades of skipped payments were made………
            You call it mugging of the taxpayer. That’s Obsurd!!!! It’s paying for a service. Some more essential than others. But nonetheless a service provided that you must pay for.
            Whether you or anyone feels salaries are too much or not enough is another discussion. The same can be said about ceo’s. Are they worth the billions they get paid??? Are the athletes really worth millions to throw a ball?? But we pay. Same crap. But instead of going after the real crooks…. Some of you would rather call these middle class public workers the crook!!!!! Makes me ashamed of most of you.

          • Posted by Tough Love on August 5, 2015 at 2:06 pm

            bpaterson, My above comment was directed to BH, not to you …. something that BH recognized, and prompted responded to with more of his same obfuscation and BS …. surprise, surprise.

  7. Posted by BH on August 4, 2015 at 8:29 pm

    Quote-” the public employees, who I detest, ”
    You sound just like chrispie…. The very man your saying they should rebel against!!
    Therefore , you make no sense and should keep your stupid comments to yourself!!

    Reply

    • Posted by Tough Love on August 4, 2015 at 9:47 pm

      BH,

      I’m still laughing at your calling the internet the …”interwebs”.

      Reminds me of the GEICO commercial with the 3 old ladies with one “posting” pictures …. by pasting paper copies on her wall, and the other (somewhat internet) saying …….

      “that’s not how it works, that not how any of this works”.

      I’d bet that YOU are a NJ Public Sector retiree, or more likely an “active” with 5-10 years to go and know that if they Freeze your pension (as recommended by the NJ pension Commission) HALF of what you plan on getting vaporizes.

      Hopefully that WILL happen ………. NOT because I’m mean or jealous, but because you never deserved it in the first place, and as a NJ taxpayer, I don’t want to help pay for it.

      Reply

      • Posted by S Moderation Douglas on August 4, 2015 at 10:43 pm

        “NOT because I’m mean or jealous, ”

        “See my long comment above.”

        Reply

      • Posted by fouls123 on August 5, 2015 at 2:40 am

        TL, How can you possibly know if a particular person deserved the benefits they received or not? Who made you God? You will never have the opportunity, but I believe that if you had done the work that I have done over 32 years plus in a prison, dealing faced to face with murders, rapists and the like face to face alone and virtually surrounded by as many as 30 inmates at any given time, unarmed and trying to help them prepare for the future while also handling the prison’s staff safety programs and safety training and supervising staff in two units of over 300 inmates each, traveling between them some 30 miles apart and trying to find enough time in the day to manage the prison’s halfway house program as well, I think you might feel my benefits were well earned. You can talk all you want in generalities about public workers and NJ workers in comparison with the private sector, but in many cases there are no real comparison to be made.I know I earned every penny in salary and benefits that were promised me.At one time I worked in a factory when I was much younger. I often wondered if I would have been happier there without all of the day to day stress, long hours and day to day pressure I dealt with in the prison It takes a definite toll on you mentally as well as physically and the benefits will never come close to making up for what it does to you. All this talk is only to ease the consciences of the tax payers so they can feel okay about ripping off retirees. So go ahead with your rants, deep down inside if you have a conscience and a sense of fairness you know it’s wrong. Why don’t you save your rants for the corporate CEOs, pro athletes and owners, Wall Street bankers,and people like Christie and Romney who are stealing you blind every day through an unfair tax system, government handouts and the like. We have public money going to them in much larger numbers through government built stadiums government backed loans to casinos that go bankrupt etc. Public workers aren’t getting rich on your dime, but these guys are. State employees for the most part are just trying to scrape out a living and try to survive after retirement the same as most people and they pay taxes the sames as everyone else. I say from what I have seen in state government, tax payers for the most part have gotten a bargain from their public service workforce. But most of the complainers on here have never worked for the public and are really not qualified to make an educated comment.

        Reply

        • Posted by Tough Love on August 5, 2015 at 3:39 am

          Quoting … “TL, How can you possibly know if a particular person deserved the benefits they received or not?”

          IT’S VERY SIMPLE …… comparably qualified Public sector workers doing comparable jobs do NOT deserve greater Taxpayer-funded compensation.

          It’s not difficult to line up Public & Private Sector workers in jobs with comparable risks, educational and experience requirements, knowledge, and skill sets. Studies show that in NJ there is a 4% “cash pay” DISADVANTAGE, that swings to a 23%* “Total Compensation” ADVANTAGE once the FAR FAR greater value of PUBLIC Sector pensions & benefits are included in the comparison.

          That is a HUGE HUGE monetary advantage …. one that for many employees would add up if invested over one’s career to over $1 Million …… money UNJUSTLY paid for by the Taxpayers.
          —————————————————

          I know that police (or corrections) work can be dangerous …. but many far lower paid occupations (loggers, fisherman,etc.**) are far MORE dangerous. The danger does NOT justify the compensation. If it did, we would be paying $25/lb for the cheapest fish, and $1 Million for the cheapest stick-built house.

          It so obvious …. your Unions have BOUGHT our self-interested, vote selling, contribution-soliciting, taxpayer-betraying elected officials’ favorable votes on Public Sector pay, pensions, and benefits with campaign contributions and election support. If not for that, Total Compensation would be HALF what it is today … mostly via pensions & benefits no greater than their Private Sector counterparts ……… which is exactly what I strongly advocate for, AND what has been proposed by the NJ Pension Commission.
          —————————————————–

          * 34% adding in the MUCH greater Public Sector job security … like being out of work for a few years over one’s career, quite common in the Private Sector.

          ** The 10 most dangerous occupations … per the US Gov’t BLS:

          10. Construction Laborers
          9. Electrical Power-Line Installers And Repairers
          8. Farmers, Ranchers, And Other Agricultural Managers
          7. Driver/Sales Workers and Truck Drivers
          6. Mining Machine Operators
          5. Refuse And Recyclable Material Collectors
          4. Roofers
          3. Aircraft Pilots And Flight Engineers
          2. Fishers And Related Fishing Workers
          1. Logging Workers

          Reply

          • Posted by BH on August 5, 2015 at 9:05 am

            For every article you pull showing one thing….. I can find another opposing view….. The INTERWEBS a vast and seemingly endless……

            http://www.careercast.com/jobs-rated/most-dangerous-jobs-2015

          • Posted by Tough Love on August 5, 2015 at 4:04 pm

            BH, so is the US Government’s BLS list of the 10 MOST DANGEROUS occupations false, or is it that YOU are just full of BS ?

          • Posted by BH on August 5, 2015 at 7:57 pm

            I posted an article that disputes what you say….
            Surprised that you find anger in that. Lol!!!! Silly lady

          • Posted by Tough Love on August 5, 2015 at 9:02 pm

            Your linked listing is from a Private outfit called CareerCast, which based there determination of the Most Dangerous Occupation as follows:

            “CareerCast compiled a list of the top 10 most dangerous jobs in the U.S. by looking at two factors: the degree of danger one personally faces and the hazards others face while working alongside.”

            Sounds quite “subjective” and therefore open to manipulation. Who know which groups (if any) fund them …. Public Sector Unions? Corporations ? I don’t know.

            I prefer a source less subjective, such as death statistics by occupation from the US Gov’t BLS, as reported in the following Bloomberg article:

            http://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2015-dangerous-jobs/

            You’ll notice that Police Officers are 14-th on that list and Firefighters are 26-th, both behind such FAR FAR lower paying jobs such as fishermen, loggers, steel workers, roofers, farmers, ranchers, construction workers, taxi-drivers, etc.

            Need I say more ?????

            Public Sector safety workers are VASTLY over compensated …. as are most OTHER Public Sector workers via their ABSURDLY GENEROUS pensions & benefits.

      • Posted by BH on August 5, 2015 at 9:02 am

        Interwebs was a joke….. It’s intent was to make the readers giggle.
        In between your detest and hatred for the public workers and jealousy derived from comparing you to them with your equal and fair Carl there is nothing wrong with a smile from time to time TL!!

        Reply

      • Posted by Anonymous on August 5, 2015 at 9:51 am

        Well TL, you’re going to help pay for it!! Like it or not.
        Essential services…. Police, Fire, EMS. You use them but don’t want to help pay for it??? Typical BS mentality. It’s just you wanting something for nothing once again!!! I’ve figured you out TL.
        You want the benefits but only if it’s free.
        Snow removal, road repair, prison containment, children educated, ….. And on and on….. But you don’t want to help pay for it!!!! Typical greedy private sector mentality.
        Luckily you are only less than 1%. As most people side with the workers!!!!

        Reply

        • Posted by Tough Love on August 5, 2015 at 10:57 am

          Quoting …. “Police, Fire, EMS. You use them but don’t want to help pay for it?”,

          In the bedroom communities of NJ (95% if NJ), $200+K in Total Compensation (pay + pensions + benefits) for a policeman with 5 years of service …. is beyond absurd.

          Reply

          • Posted by BH on August 5, 2015 at 11:35 am

            Spew away TL…… $200k plus….. Lol!!!! What a joke!!!!

          • Posted by BH on August 5, 2015 at 11:39 am

            Firefighterfactsnj.org

            Plug in your town…..

          • Posted by Tough Love on August 5, 2015 at 2:11 pm

            Yup, with just 5 years of service, most NJ patrolman make OVER $125K in BASE pay, the cost of CURRENT benefits (life and disability insurance, and family healthcare for most), and the TRUE cost of FULLY funding their outrageously generous pensions & benefits over their working career EASILY takes their total annual compensation over $200K annually.

        • Posted by Anonymous on August 5, 2015 at 6:32 pm

          Most people don’t side with PW’s!!!

          Reply

          • Posted by Tough Love on August 5, 2015 at 6:55 pm

            Anon,

            I doubt BH really BELIEVES his BS, but somehow he believes his BS, and lies, help his goal …. to keep100% of the grossly excessive pension & benefits that have been promised … even for FUTURE Service …. no mater how excessive, unnecessary, unjust, unfair to Taxpayers, and unaffordable.

            It’s called insatiable GREED.

          • Posted by BH on August 5, 2015 at 7:58 pm

            Yes they do

          • Posted by Tough Love on August 5, 2015 at 8:45 pm

            Ok BH, now that you have admitted to your “insatiable greed” ….. by saying “yes they do” to keeping …..”100% of the grossly excessive pension & benefits that have been promised … even for FUTURE Service …. no mater how excessive, unnecessary, unjust, unfair to Taxpayers, and unaffordable. ” ………. where do we go from here ?

    • Posted by S Moderation Douglas on August 4, 2015 at 10:49 pm

      TL is right, BH. Everyone knows “interweb” is singular, not plural.

      And:

      “that’s not how it works, that not how any of this works”.

      Is a description of the “Fireman Fallacy”, and the “SAME, SAME, SAME” rant. It is illogical.

      Reply

  8. Posted by Tough Love on August 5, 2015 at 11:10 am

    Excellent article … required reading for ALL:

    http://www.wsj.com/articles/democrats-need-a-scott-walker-1438730749
    (Google the title and click on the WSJ link if you cannot get the FULL article)

    Title … Democrats Need a Scott Walker

    Best paragraph …….

    “His important fight, which led to the 2012 recall effort, unwound a 1959 experiment in union representation for public employees that proved a bad idea for all the reasons FDR and other traditional liberals warned. It gave rise to what some call the blue-state governance model, combining a stagnant, overtaxed private sector, a bloated public sector, and a long-term pension time bomb of the sort nowadays blowing up in cities and states (and Puerto Rico) around the country.”

    Reply

  9. […] is worse than Jessica Alba for New Jersey pensioners.  Look at a list of alternative investments in the Division of […]

    Reply

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