Believing Lies


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It may not be a lie to you but what about the ones you tell it to? There were four times in today’s Ask the Governor program with Chris Christie when the pension issue came up and there were at least three times that, by all objective criteria, he lied.

Telling a 62-year-old retiree that he would “continue to get his checks for the rest of his life”…
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Though what was not mentioned was the amount of those checks and that what that retiree is now getting has already been reduced through the elimination of cost-of-living adjustments.

Not paying for the “mistakes of his predecessors” who did not make the required contributions…
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One of those predecessors being the guy from four years ago who skipped a $3 billion pension payment, though Christie might be considering that guy with the extra 85 pounds as a different person.
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Double down by calling your lie a truth:
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So his truth is that he’s “taking on” the pension problem by not contributing to it just like every other administration, one way or another, has done over the last 25 years?

And then there is the truth that, if true, is scarier than any lie:
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Either the judiciary is in his pocket or he really has “no idea” what to do. Either way, hard to believe this is how low we have sunk – except for those who really understand how New Jersey politics works.

36 responses to this post.

  1. Posted by Tough Love on June 17, 2014 at 1:09 am

    Quoting …”So his truth is that he’s “taking on” the pension problem by not contributing to it just like every other administration, one way or another, has done over the last 25 years?”

    It seems clear to me that by saying he is “taking on the pension system”, he is alluding to the additional pension (and very likely benefit) reductions that he will be announcing within the next few weeks.

    Reply

  2. Posted by Anonymous on June 17, 2014 at 2:20 am

    TL, putting her faith where it belongs, in the most honest man in government since Abe Lincoln! bwahahahahhahahahhahahaha. I bet you were also believer in the late great Tricky Dick Nixon.

    Reply

    • Posted by Tough Love on June 17, 2014 at 8:25 am

      Actually, Christie would have a reasonable (long-term) shot at succeeding to address the financial mess NJ is in ….. IF ALL CURRRENT-worker DB pensions were frozen (ZERO future growth), and replaced with a DC-based retirement package EQUAL TO that TYPICALLY granted Private Sector workers by their employers. And EQUAL Public Sector retiree healthcare subsidies as well ….. meaning NONE.

      Do you have a problem with “EQUAL” ? Why is that? Perhaps GREED ?

      Of course, there is a snowballs chance in hell that NJ’s Elected Officials, BOUGHT-OFF with your Union’s campaign contributions (or threats to re-election) will allow these VERY much needed and just pension & benefit changes to happen.

      So if you want someone to blame, just look in the mirror.

      Reply

      • Posted by Anonymous on June 17, 2014 at 9:38 am

        Over and Over you say they must be equal to private sector employees…..equal to what some silly formula or percentages you found somewhere trolling the net, your own experiences? Private sector employees are not equal to each other. Try researching plans no two are alike. The EXXON pension plan is a defined benefits plan, one can retire at 55.

        Walmart one of the largest employers in the US has no retirement plan except that they will match 6% (wow) of the employees contribution to their 401K.

        Then we have McDonalds Employees who save just 1 percent of pay get $3 from the company for every $1 stashed in their 401(k). The next 4 percent of pay contributed is matched by the company $1 for $1. The rub here is that is only for the less than 100 company stores. The rest are franchises who can offer 401K or not. Most probably not.
        My brother in law works for McDonalds (not in a store but the maintenance and landscaping for 20 stores owned by a single franchisee). He has no retirement plan but he does get all the big Macs and fries he can eat, in fact while he is working he is required to eat at McD’s he cannot bring his own lunch. So in his case he needs no retirement plan.

        So there are examples of three very large American Companies with 3 different approaches to retirement, as anyone with an open mind can see they are not equal to each other.

        Do public pensions need an overhaul, well maybe just some tinkering.

        1 Eliminate double dipping, when you retire from State or Local government you are finished, if you want to continue to work go into the private sector.

        2.Stop paying all these advisers etc commissions assemble a small group of proven consultants and pay them a good salary but make them employees, Many years ago in a world far away when the State and Locals made contributions there was one man (a civil service employee) who was in charge of investments. His investment strategies kept the funds solvent.

        3. I would say adopt a plan similar to Rhode Island but absolutely no one in this State could run such a plan. If one reads the plan everything is on a sliding scale geared to paying essentially what is being paid now (to retirees) but slowly extracting the State from large defined benefits but not fully. An employee with lets say 5 years left to retirement age (the cutoff is all with less than 5 years get the full DB amount) will get more of a DB amount then lets say someone with 10 years who will get less of a DB and will have to rely more on DC (which the State will also match) in retirement. I am sure there are computer programs which the employee can rely on to adjust his contributions to suit his needs. BTW there is still a COLA adjustment for the DB portion. All retirees will see no cuts in benefits the State of RI recognizes they have a commitment to those retired and close to retirement. There is an adjustment to COLA but they did not up and lose it like NJ.

        4. Keep a closer eye on retirees with disability pensions.If you are disabled so be it relax and stay out of the job market. Enough said on that

        If the State did all or even some of the above and made their contributions the funds would be able to pay the required benefits and be on the long road to solvency. There is no need to throw out the baby with the wash water just take prudent and slow steps to bring health to the system. Will the State do these things I doubt it. They will try to take the approach of vilifying the public worker so the public and some bloggers will chant “off with their (public workers) heads oh and while we are at it cut em off at the knees too an 80 year old retiree should just be sitting in a chair anyway watching the soaps” Wait Christie has done that already.

        There is over 70 Billion in the retirement fund if the politicians would stop stealing the money and looking at the funds as a slush fund,and honestly try to save the plan the sky will not fall and the sun will rise tomorrow and workers can look forward to a secure retirement as promised.

        Reply

        • Posted by Tough Love on June 17, 2014 at 10:22 am

          So, it’s not difficult to calculate an “average” (generosity) Private Sector retirement Plan. Public Sector workers should get no greater Taxpayer funding towards their pensions than Private Sector employers would need to contribute to that “average” Private Sector Plan … and I’m CERTAIN that contribution would be 1/4-1/3 of the responsibility now assigned to Taxpayers for the Grossly excessive Public Sector Pension promised EVERYWHERE.

          It all comes down to GREED.

          And while your suggestions are in the right directions, in total, they are FAR from sufficient to fix the mess we are in nor would the resultant Plans be fair to Taxpayers, as they would remain FAR FAR more generous.than what the typical Private Sector workrs gets from his/her employer.

          Reply

        • Posted by Anonymous on June 17, 2014 at 11:13 am

          Walmart and McDonald’s were not meant to be “career” jobs unless you are management or franchise owners. The jobs were meant to be part-time, flexible hours, supplemental income type jobs. Because there has been no growth in the economy of NJ and and nation wide the new solution is that companies will be forced to pay a government mandated wage for unskilled, student, extra income type jobs. It really has nothing to do with the pension mess in NJ and across the country. The pensioners are relying on the government to fund their overly generous retirements while expecting the employees of Walmart and McDonald’s work until their 85 to pay for it all.

          Reply

      • Posted by Anonymous on June 17, 2014 at 9:59 am

        I got paid less than half of what public sector bus drivers and maintenance workers got paid. I have no problem with equal if you give me all the back pay I am entitled to and it should be between 250-350k for the entire 40 years

        Reply

        • Posted by Tough Love on June 17, 2014 at 10:26 am

          If you meant “private” and not “public” in your comment, and are trying to say that Private Sector bus workers earn more in cash pay than Public Sector bus workers, you just gave me the laugh of the day as Private Sector bus drivers generally don’t make much more than the minimum wage.

          Reply

          • Posted by Anonymous on June 17, 2014 at 1:11 pm

            Private sector bus drivers with a CDL license make an excellent salary when working for a private company in New Jersey. I remember at least 10 years ago, drivers were making 21 dollars per hour in a similar private sector job to what I had. And by the way. pubic schools use private school bus companies to provide transportation. I do remember when I was getting 5.25 per hour, they were getting 10-12 dollars per hour. It is sad that think everyone is lying all the time. I am feel sorry for you because of that. You also seem very jealous. You also need to realize that every single public employee does not make a salary equal to private employees and I myself made less. I did it because I needed the benefits. Oh well this is like talking to a wall.

  3. Posted by Anonymous on June 17, 2014 at 7:39 am

    Newsflash! There is no plan A, well, except to lie feverishly!

    Reply

  4. Posted by Anonymous on June 17, 2014 at 8:31 am

    Of course Christie has the Judiciary (at least some of it) in his pocket. Take the COLA case which was heard before Judge Hurd a non tenured Superior Court Judge. He ruled in favor of Christie but refused to give a written opinion to justify his ruling. He is now the Presiding Judge in Mercer County.

    The Appellate Court heard the case but postponed their ruling until summer, I think there is only a better than 50/50 chance the Cola will be restored. He had a chance to do plenty of arm twisting until now. He has to the states case was weak and the lawyer sounded like he was just going through the motions. BUT I could be wrong.

    If the Cola is not restored it will go to the Supreme Court of NJ which will in all likely hood will restore the COLA, three years from now.

    Judge Jacobson who is hearing the contribution theft will rule for Christie, she has no choice it is both too late to do anything, no one will lend the state any money and she could justify it by saying the constitutional requirement of a balanced budget trumps an already questionable law.

    A much better solution would be to require the contribution as required by law in installments over the next 12 months with interest. This essentially will make the State pension fund the defacto lender.

    Christie has played his hand perfectly everyone is backed into a corner and has no choice in these matters just as he planned all along. The only good to come of all of his deeds as governor will be to give the Dems a lot of ammunition for campaign ads in 2016.

    He should just resign himself that he is done politically after he is governor. He can become a stay at home dad so he can justify his father of the year award or take his dancing skills on the road.

    Reply

    • Posted by Tough Love on June 17, 2014 at 8:51 am

      Quoting …”A much better solution would be to require the contribution as required by law in installments over the next 12 months with interest. ”

      No, the better solution is to freeze the DB Plan for ALL participants. ZERO future growth. All Public Sector DB Plans are grossly excessive and unaffordable.

      ALL politicians (whether Democratic or Republican) simply cannot control themselves when there are giant pots of money around that can be manipulated for political gain. THAT’s why ALL Public Sector DB Plan should be frozen and replaced with DC Plans of EQUAL (but not greater) value to those typically granted Private Sector workers.

      Of course “EQUAL” is never satisfactory to the insatiably greedy Public Sector Unions/workers.

      Reply

      • Posted by Anonymous on June 17, 2014 at 9:48 am

        Over and over and over ad nauseum you state and I quote “replaced with DC Plans of EQUAL (but not greater) value to those typically granted Private Sector workers.” There is no typical plan so your argument is specious (you can look that up).

        Reply

        • Posted by Tough Love on June 17, 2014 at 10:30 am

          Yea, we can’t figure out a Plan roughly “equal” to the average of what Private Sector workers receive in retirement pensions ….. so do nothing. Brilliant !

          Now, what is your IQ ?

          Reply

          • Posted by Anonymous on June 17, 2014 at 10:46 am

            Well now your plan is to be “roughly equal”. There is no average it would be an impossible task. I agree with the poster above lets reform the system with slow deliberate reforms I never said do nothing you did.

            Face the facts you will never get what you propose you should settle for slow and meaningful reform. Did you ever think you support retirement for lets say Exxon/Mobil and the other oil companies generous retirement plans every time you fill your car (unless you have a Tesla). I am sure your reply will be I use Sunoco…well guess what.

            I see you are getting flustered when someone does not agree with you, you raise the IQ question. Hey I do not know what my IQ is what does that matter?. I possess something far more important that an IQ number that would be common sense in actually trying to solve a problem rather than scream and yell that your solution is the only solution. Take a breath chill. Its a beautiful day enjoy it.

        • Posted by Anonymous on June 17, 2014 at 11:17 am

          Anon 9:48am Why don’t you try and contribute something of substance to the discussion instead of bashing TL simply b/c she doesn’t agree with you. Perhaps you should heed some of what she is saying, you know, “just in case” it doesn’t turn out how you hope. Your insults and aggressive comments make you sound immature. No body is right and no body is wrong but the pension mess still exists and I suspect that if you were so confident that you would be getting all “promised” to you for the rest of your life, you wouldn’t be on here bashing TL or anyone else.

          Reply

          • Posted by Anonymous on June 17, 2014 at 1:17 pm

            wow, talk about being blind, have you read any of TLs posts? You are correct, there is certainly no bashing or insults. I mean calling state worker greedy morons with low intelligence is a very nice thing to do. Get ready she will deny she ever does this even though it is done repetitively. She would make a good right hand woman for Christie, lie in the face of the truth, they cant catch you anyway.

          • Posted by Anonymous on June 17, 2014 at 1:35 pm

            There are no insults I can see in the post you refer to. He/she is using TL’s own quotes and stating that he finds them not to be accurate as anon feels there is no typical plan. TL’s answer to that post is the insulting one questioning his/her IQ. TL is the one that throws insults and is unwavering in the opinions he/she writes.

          • Posted by Tough Love on June 17, 2014 at 1:47 pm

            Yes, I am unwavering in my opinions, but no, I don’t insult anyone (other than calling Public Sector Unions/workers “greedy” … and I stand by that 1000%) … including Public Sector workers.

            If you re-read Anon’s 9:48AM comment (and my 10:30AM response) you might agree that questioning his/her IQ was not a bad idea.

  5. Posted by Anonymous on June 17, 2014 at 8:38 am

    Is it me or is his nose getting bigger it sure looks that way in the side shots in the pictures. I do hope he runs for president (he will get his butt kicked by whoever the Democrats nominate) he will have to resign hmmm but then we get Kimmie…..well at least she will just lock herself in her office and never utter a word while NJ sinks into the mud.Oh well only in NJ.

    Reply

  6. Posted by JM on June 17, 2014 at 6:12 pm

    Wow busy day lots of back and forth bantering. Sorry I missed it but it was a glorious day today. We were able to take the boat out of the inlet today as the ocean was calm. I don’t get out on the ocean as much as I would like as I could only afford a 24ft boat with my “boat check”. Saw a pod of dolphins maybe only a half mile from shore, and actually saw a loggerhead turtle swim next to the boat. Came back in hung out at the sand bar with a few other retirees from up north and the usual sand bar crew for a while. Then went over and tied up at a clam bar on the intracoastal by the causeway for a few frozen drinks and steamers. Then tied up the boat at the marina and came home and sat on the beach where I am now.

    Later on tonight we are going over to the Mexican Place for happy hour 2 for 1 drinks (which is all day) and the free Taco Bar.

    Well that was my day hope you enjoyed yours.

    Reply

    • Posted by truthnolie on June 17, 2014 at 9:26 pm

      LOL….Good for you!

      By the way….that sound you hear is Tough Love, Javagold and other anti-Public Employees slamming their keyboards & smashing their fists down on their tiny fake plastic wood desks in windowless cubicles inhaling stale air while trying to keep from going postal due to their envious rage.

      Reply

  7. Posted by Anonymous on June 17, 2014 at 10:02 pm

    I went play tennis everyday and take relaxing walk on nature trails. You know we would have anything that we have or be able to do anything that we enjoy if it werent for TL.

    Reply

    • Posted by Tough Love on June 17, 2014 at 10:09 pm

      WOW …. A night class in proper English might be more helpful to you than tennis or nature trail walks.

      Reply

  8. Posted by Anonymous on June 18, 2014 at 3:40 am

    TL skimped terribly on my education costs. However she left me with fantastic advice which she always employs herself. Always blame the spell check! 🙂

    Reply

  9. Posted by Anonymous on June 18, 2014 at 3:41 am

    I am bilingual but I dont speak english.

    Reply

  10. Posted by Anonymous on June 18, 2014 at 8:16 am

    Actually, I was accepted to college in my junior year of high school. A more clear and concise manner of stating what TL stated above would be: A night class in English grammar may be more helpful than playing tennis or walking nature trails.
    I almost forgot the best excuse for spelling and grammar mistake according to TL, drunkenness!

    Reply

  11. Posted by Tough Love on June 18, 2014 at 8:51 am

    I find the Public Sector worker-driven personal attacks very interesting …. shows how concerned you are of the truthful content of my comments.

    You should be, as Private Sector Taxpayers are rapidly wising-up to the enormous long-term financial “mugging” perpetrated upon them by the Public Sector Unions/workers (in cahoots with their elected officials). The pace of pension/benefit reform (MATERIAL reform) will only accelerate … as there are no other workable options.

    Otherwise, why would you bother ?

    Reply

  12. Posted by Anonymous on June 18, 2014 at 1:30 pm

    You gravy sucking pig! I have nothing better to do and suppose either do you. Nothing it going to get accomplish in this blog, this certain!

    Reply

    • Posted by Tough Love on June 18, 2014 at 1:46 pm

      Be assured that I comment elsewhere … with the same TRUTHFUL wake-up call for Taxpayers.

      While NJ is near the top of the list of States (and Cities) in the worst financial position due to these grossly excessive pension & benefit promises, most others trail not far behind.

      A NATIONAL Taxpayer-driven effort to end (or at least MATERIALLY reduce) these DB pensions is on the horizon.

      Reply

  13. Posted by Anonymous on June 18, 2014 at 2:17 pm

    are you a woman or a mouse? stand up and be counted my little droogie

    Reply

    • Posted by Tough Love on June 18, 2014 at 2:43 pm

      Definition from Wiki …

      droogie …

      playful term to describe your significant other or even a hobby. usually used to describe something you really really really (you can see where i’m goin’ with this) like.

      ————————————–

      Glad you like all that I have been sharing !

      Reply

  14. Posted by Anonymous on June 18, 2014 at 4:51 pm

    TL, I wouldn’t even respond to them. I don’t believe a word that they say but their immature schoolyard comments betrays their convictions that they will be receiving pension checks for the rest of their lives. So enjoy the turtles and the dolphins while you can. Accepted into college during his junior year of high school–I really had a good laugh over that one. TL, please stop responding to them unless they have something of import to contribute to the discussion of the demise of the pensions.

    Reply

    • Posted by Anonymous on June 18, 2014 at 5:38 pm

      You will find she loves this game immensely. You can beg all you want, but the back and forth nonsensical banter causes her adrenalin to surge mightily!
      You state that you really had a good laugh over that one, har har har! oh boy! I am surprised that you believe that without any pension all public employees wont be able to enjoy dolphins and turtles. Very superficial ! Now everyone watch as this is not ignored by the very one who has given orders to ignore! Dont listen to him/her TL you know what you are doing, he/she doesnt have a bloody clue how we roll in this blog.

      Reply

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